Hi Martin....

Finally used your idea to take a picture of the back side of the engine plates. The ratio is: 2.21 Can you explain what that means...?

I rarely have to "push" the engine...does 4 knots and up to 6 knots screaming. This seems to be a pretty good match..no problem with big currents going in and out the inlets to the Gulf.

Regarding the prop clearance...I DO have good clearance from the boat. I think that the manufacturing process becomes "custom" to fit the buyers request. In my case, the man who attempted make a business and to import and sell Parker here in the states (also coincidentally called Mr. Parker) was a wheeler and dealer type. besides the larger motor, beautiful wool fabric cushions....he had quite a few changes such as a liferaft storage box with an opening from the cockpit sole. Full canvas....even making a "room" in the cockpit. The boat was brought in for the Miami boat show.1989..Bill Parker came also. They had the 21 and the 27...I found the boat advertised in Sail mag....drove down to Miami and bought it on the spot. I wonder where the 21 is ..somewhere here?

let me know if I can send any info..measurements etc.... or pictures....as this is a very good experience for me... we should publish your notes.

Marv

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The 2.21:1 mentioned on your gearbox (which is the same as mine) is the gearbox reduction ratio as the propellor turns slower than the engine, so, on your gearbox when you are running at say 2800rpm the prop is turning at 1266rpm The two other reduction ratios you can get on Yanmar 1GM10s and 2GM20s are even greater reduction, 2.62:1 and 3.06:1 but you would need to swing an even larger prop with greater pitch to get similar performance, which is fine if you have the space and tip clearance for a larger prop but doesn't work on the Parkers. I am very interested in your cockpit locker stowage for a liferaft, as I have been wondering where I could fit one in my boat as I would like to go further afield (France and Ireland) and a liferaft would be prudent. If you have a chance to send some dimensions and or pictures would be great.

I am slowly sorting out the logistics and amassing the various bits and pieces needed to carry out the swap. I am making a steel framed lifting cradle with a rolling carriage so that I can first lift the engine from the side of the boat into the cockpit then moving the framework over the cockpit and companionway, I can then lift the old engine out, lift the new one in then move the cradle again to drop the old engine over the side. the cradle consists of a a length of thick wall 40mm x 40mm steel box section (rounded corners) with end plates to which are attached 2"x4" timber legs that span the cockpit then a dolly made from 2" nylon for the roller and two side plates with a 10mm bolt as a axle and a lifting pulley arrangement hanging off it. To clear the galley and allow me to swing the engine in beneath it, i have made up a "C" frame, also from 40x40mm thick wall box section with lifting points on the extremities, one connected to the engine lifting point and the other used to lift the whole arrangement. it is 24" on each side. This should obviate the need to try and slide the engine in and out which would have caused problems with the sump catching on the sill of the engine bay bilge sump which I did not want to cut down as it may allow bilge water to end up in the cabin in the future.It will also mean I can position the engine, mark the fixing points then lift it out to drill the holes for the coach bolts, then swing it back in again without too much difficulty. I have checked and with the front of the engine in the same position as the old engine, I can still get to the shaft coupling from the engine bay, it being only 3" further back, it also means i can still retain the waster strainer in the same position in front of the engine which is where it was before and is easy to access by removing the steps, it also means i don't have to redirect the ducting for my Eberspacher which is ducted over the top of the engine on the portside before turning down right at the front to a floor level outlet. (The Eberspacher is fitted below the cockpit floor, in a position approximately below the throttle lever, trying to use some of the huge amount off unusable space below the cockpit floor. As I say, the idea of being able to fit some form of cockpit floor locker to stow the liferaft sounds very appealing. Is yours a sealed box below the cockpit sole or simply a watertight access hatch to the whole space? I will try to send some pictures of the whole arrangement, once I am ready to go.

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Hi Martin,

Well you are well along...always seems more complicated as we proceed. Martin..I think you'll end up cutting the small bilge sill to make it easier to just slide in. My engine oil pan sits low..just enough to slide my hand and wipe out the bilge.

Also.... not sure I mentioned..if the engine is used...do replace the zincs side and rear. And make sure you have a better way to tighten the generator belt from the front..once mounted..you will have to work from the rear ...think of a better way as my belt is always too loose.

Regarding the fiberglass cockpit storage locker.

I will take some pictures for you. If you are clever as your are...with fiberglass, doing a box will be easy to make cut out the floor fit the box and glass in...you will want some drains to run to the scuppers....when you see the pictures you will know.

A cover will be a problem when you cut the floor for the box....you will not be able to use the same floor piece as the door to the box...it has to be made larger than the box with a 90 degree turned down surround for stiffness and to fit into the drain slot you have made around the box.

I have never used this box and it is so big I can't get under it to get into the rear bulkhead. A picture will be good for you to see. Also... it fills with some water so I have made a special molded clear seal as a gasket. It stays dry but empty. Pics coming.

Marv

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It may be of interest that amongst the many useful articles in the technical handbook is one by Bill Parker which was written in response to noise/cavitation issues and detailed the optimum arrangement derived from various tests.

I found it in an early edition of the handbook which is currently on the boat but I jotted down the measurements.It's notable that they produce a projection of shaft much longer than the normal rule of thumb would give.My own sterngear with an original 2GM20 matches these.The shaft projection looks visually overlong even when a spur ropecutter is in place.

prop setout 

I can retrieve the original article if required.

Peter

'Fulmar of Hollowshore'

Super Seal 27 #131

Hello Peter, thank you for the information which is interesting because that is how my old prop/shaft setup was before I fitted the new folder, however when I mentioned it to Paul Bell of 1st Marine Propulsion at Southampton, he said that was a 'no-no' as it would potentially cause accelerated wear on the cutless bearing and excessive vibration and made the shaft more vulnerable to distortion. It would of course increase the tip clearance and allow a larger diameter prop. The normal rule is between 100~150% of shaft diameter which in my case with a 1" shaft means 1"~1.5" and minimum tip clearance should be 10% prop diameter or 1.3" with a 13" prop, 15% is preferable. I'm surprised Bill Parker did not redesign the shaft log to allow it to project further aft to allow for positioning the prop further back. This may be another project to look into next year, I have a metre length of the GRP tube used for shaft logs so I may look into that. I believe I can get large blades for my folder which will reduce the cost of replacement rather than replacing the whole shebang. As the new engine installation is going to push the engine back about three inches, I may just hold off cutting the shaft down and see how it goes over next year.

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I'm sure you're right about the cutlass bearing.Strange that Bill Parker's installation engineers didn't raise this wear issue either during the tests they made or during normal production.In fact my owners manual refers to an 'Autolube bearing' fed from a gravity fed reservoir bottle and accessible through the cockpit locker so perhaps the stern bearing was then intended to get some of this oil ? There has been a stuffing box since '95.

HI...

My boat has a "autolube" ....I took a picture of it...so look for it here....as soon as I figure how to do the pic.

Marv

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I hope these pictures show details that you can use.

Marv

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Here a couple engine shots showing amount of room you will have.

Marv

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"It may be of interest that amongst the many useful articles in the technical handbook"

Hey Peter... what technical handbook....??? I would sure like to get a copy.

Marv

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Hi Marvin,

First of all thank you for posting shots of the autolube with reservoir.So it's a gland fed by oil rather than my present grease fed version.I'm never sure quite what is intended as the stuffing is supposed to be kept cool by a weep of water coming through the stern tube via the cutlass bearing.In effect by adding waterproof grease under pressure it's inevitable that it will pass not only back into the stern tube but also forward onto the packing/stuffing.So really a balancing act.

The technical handbook contains not only the manufacturer's data from Baker and Parker but also a compilation of selected articles from the newsletters including responses direct from John Baker and then from Bill Parker.I'm not sure where else one would see such constructive and open discussion,but from my point of view it was a further inducement to buy a Seal rather than a 'modern' marque where the manufacturer's and their distributors remain inscrutable.

The current Technical Handbook contains selected articles from 1978 to 1995.Earlier versions contained less and apparently a few different articles.

The technical handbook is available from Di Drew,listed at the bottom of the regalia page, at £10 plus postage.

It's an excellent resource and the pre cursor to todays technical discussions.

Best wishes,Peter

Thank you for the pictures of your engine installation and the cockpit locker space which looks to be quite a substantial affair. Is it fully sealed or can water get into it and if so does it have a drain? If I have time this winter (and it's not too cold for GRP work) I may consider making an installation like that. Regarding the engine installation, I intend to mount the engine a little further back which will leave space in front for me to put back my water strainer in the same location as it was before, on the left hand side (looking aft) just behind the companionway steps, I have also had some more thoughts about the extended prop shaft and I believe I can solve the problem by glassing in an extended shaft tube, extending the tube by 3". The GRP specialist in the yard were I keep my boat, thinks this would be relatively easy to do and this extension would house the cutlass bearing and thereby support the prop and tube in its extended position. As to the shaft seal, my boat is fitted with a variation of the PSS shaft seal (sometimes called deep sea seals?) which only needs to be 'burped' by distorting the rubber housing if the boat dries out, otherwise it needs no lubrication other than a light coat of grease on the shaft when installing the shaft. It may be some form of graphite impregnated rubber that bears on the shaft. I think it is lubricated and cooled by a small amount of water ingress when it is turning but is nothing more than about a cupful over several hours and I am happy with it. I will take pictures of the installation as I go and post them all when I am complete.

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Hi Martin,,,,,

You certainly have done your homework. .

Regarding the box under the cockpit..it may be too big....make it smaller so the cover won't distort....and don't forget it restricts getting under the cockpit. There is no drain..they left a wire for a bilge pump which I never used.

I make a silicone gasket and it does a good job....it is formed wet...covered with saran wrap then the cover let down to fit...wait a day or so ..put no weight on the cover and you'll have an excellent gasket. If you blow up the picture..you will find that the cover fits into a depression surrounding the box....and this depression runs to the scuppers. Depression gets dirt in there but a hose blows it out. As for the box staying absolutely dry...condensation occurs.

Good luck on your project. Look fwd to pics.

Marv

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I have the same cockpit floor locker as Marv.It was described particularly by Bill Parker in an article as intended to take an inflatable.Mine is 700 x 400 x 420 deep internally.It will accept only a transomless inflatable which would need to be completely squashed in - so perhaps ok for a hypalon model that has a loose outboard mount but not ideal for one of the cheaper fabric types.The design is such that it's perimeter,with a double upstand, drains with a channel connection to the stern outlets.Mine has a wide neoprene strip on the upstand which is slightly compressed when the two catches are home.It is not waterproof (although completely sealed to the deck with no perforations) but somehow never manages to have more than about 18mm of rainwater standing at the end of the season.It does inhibit access to the interior of the transom and to the stern tube and gland so is something of a mixed blessing.It should probably be locked/bolted into place so that it could'nt fill from a stern wave but also if intended for valuables.Our's has found best use for fenders - 4no. plump ones are a tight fit though so your own fenders would need checking.

I want some where to stow a 4 man life raft , canister or valise, that can be quickly accessed from the cockpit without going below, so I would size it to suit, also I would consider building it along the same principle as the 'bath tub' under the forward berth, so that it could be lifted out for access to the stern gland and exhaust etc. It would need to be a bit narrower than the cockpit sole, because my Eberspacher heater is under there and it would need to fit along side it, unless I move the heater forward, which is a possibilty if I had access from the cockpit, it would make a shorter air outlet run as well which is always an advantage.

I have lifted my engine out today, went like a dream with the 'C' frame and lifting hoist I made. The 'C' frame needs to be +24" inside dimensions to allow it to be close enough to the engine lifting eye whilst the top is resting on the companionway sill, the two horizontal arms only need to be 18" long each. I used a 6:1 rope tackle using two triple blocks (one with a becket) and it is now sitting in my cockpit waiting to be lowered to the ground once I take my trailer down tomorrow. I am waiting for a flexible shaft coupling to arrive before I fit the other engine. I didn't know what size to order before I removed the engine to check the coupling bolt spacing and to confirm it would fit the 2GM20. That should cut down the noise and vibration even more. When I pulled the 1GM10 today I discovered that one of the rear mounts did not have the top nut fitted. I found it and the washer at the back of the engine tray, covered in rust and gunge so it had obviously been off for a really long time. As I am fitting R &D Marine engine mounts rather than Yanmar (a hell of a lot cheaper) I need to raise the bed by 30mm. I will be using two strips of 30 x 75 x 420mm acetal which I can get from Ensinger Plastics in Waterlooville near Portsmouth. I had thought that 25mm thich would do but the maximum amount of adjustment on the R &D mounts is only 9mm so I need the extra 5mm to put the adjusters midway giving me plus or minus 4.5mm to play with based on the height of the mounts on the 1GM10. The R & D Marine mounts are captive mounts so even if the rubber fails, the engine cannot 'escape' also the rubber is protected from oil and fuel drips unlike the Yanmar mounts, so are less likely to fail. they are just over £100 for four as opposed to £174 for one Yanmar mount. Part number is 207038 from ASAP Supplies ltd. They also do the flexible shaft coupling, part number 807102.

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Hi Martin, I've sent a couple of replies to your email but have not heard back, could you check your junk folder and give me a call when you can

Kind regards

James

Hi Martin, Hope you are finishing your project....waiting for your progress and success. I have a question about something else. What is the brown rubber "teak" covering stuck down to the head floor? I would like to replace it but can't find it anywhere.

As you can see by my pix...I removed it from the cockpit seating....painted with a non skid and use my boat cushions.....rubber stuff disintegrates in the sun .....just doesn't hold up.

However...in the head..it stays quite well. 25 years now needs a refresh.

Stay in touch.

Marv

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